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Discussion Starter #1
Some of you may recall my thread of a year ago regarding the bleeding of my brakes - or complete lack of, at the 2 year service with photographic evidence.


This just corroborates my total scepticism and lack in trust of dealer servicing.

This resulted in a refund with an assurance that if i wished to avail myself of futher servicing I was to contact the Dealership manager directly and he would ensure my vehicle servicing was serviced to the highest standards and within my expectations. Shouldn't have to do that should he????

So roll on a year. Check the online booking prices. At 25K I've got 2 choices. El cheapo at less than £100 or a standard 2 year service (like I should have had last time ) at slight variations of less than £300 dependent on where you went. However my previous dealer choice was coming in at around £50 cheaper than the rest. I couldn't, I just couldn't.

So I books and travels to a dealer I have bought 2 new and 1 second hand Kias from. Books it in and informs the Service Receptionist the reasons as to why I had opted for the dearer service and the issues I;d had a year previously.

Of course when I picked the car up I examined the brake bleed screws.

I apologise for the quality but was battling extremely bright sun light. These are images taken of the rear. I was struggling to get to the front ones.

Well what do you think? As far as I'm concerned yet again and despite paying a premium they haven't been touched.

So I inform the receptionist of my concern and she scurries off. On return I'm assured that technician has completed the work. I continue to argue my case and she wants to know why I have come to my conclusion. Maybe something to do with lack of staining around the bleed screw or tool marks.

Off she scurries again. On return she informs me that the screws were cleaned down with brake cleaner. Really!!!???

Time for pictures and up the anti.

To be Continued



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Discussion Starter #2
Continued.

Pictures completed and returns with a request to speak to the Service Manager who categorically assures me that he is committed to providing customers a quality service and that that's not the sort of operation he runs.

He is totally sticking to the fact that the brakes have been bled.

I inform him that in a previous life I was authorised to test and inspect vehicles and produce evidence to court prosecution standard.

He offers to 're do' the brake bleed to give me piece of mind.

Its nearly going home time and I ain't coming back.

So its back in the workshop and the door closed.

These pictures were taken when I got home.

See the difference? Fluid stain around the bleed screw, the rubber caps are clean as they have been removed and there are tool marks on the bleed screws.

Not too hard is it?

I've not named this dealership yet as I'm taking it further.

This is twice that 2 completely seperate dealerships have tried to have me over with dishonesty.
 

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Good on you the amount of times I've took cars in for a service over the years to different dealers of different manufacturers of cars and been fobbed off that they done a proper service job ie oil change/ oil filters especially pollen filters etc and you know they haven't touched them just by visually looking like you did but they think your thick and got the same response you got a pack of lies from different staff glad you got a good outcome with your persistence 😁
 

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Surely it’s in the best interest of the garage though to do the job as if car is under warranty and problems occur then would they not be liable if found that they did not do what they were meant to e.g. turbo breaks because garage didn’t do oil change they were meant to at service? Not sure how that all works.
I do always worry that potentially at a service you end up paying for something that’s not been done as it should but you’d like to think with main dealers that this wouldn’t be the case but from the OPS message it seems that certain Kia garages are not doing what you are paying them to do. Can you go to kia direct and complain as surely they wouldn’t want them using their name if they weren’t up to the job and were basically taking money for jobs they never did?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I think this practice is widespread and sanctioned higher up. Generally cars are pretty reliable and a poor servicing regime only comes to light much further down the line when its out of warranty. They know this and are pretty much bullet proof.
The best interest of the garage is 45 minutes saved servicing time where they can 'complete' another service.
To be fair you can get away with brake fluid for extended periods to no detriment. Engine oil is the main one. Brakes are not serviced until they start making funny noises.
Last time it was mentioned to someone I understand is very high up the customer service chain at Kia by a 3rd party forum contact. Their response was as the matter had been resolved (money back) there was little they would do but they would speak to the Dealership. Yeah of course they did.
 

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Slightly OT but my 2nd hand Sportage had a towbar in the Kia dealer advertising photos. By the time of sale it had been removed and the manager claimed it was because said towbar was sub-standard. Going through the paperwork in the glovebox at home (100s of miles from the dealer), I found that the towbar had been fitted by.......Kia. Secondly, same manager assured me sat nav map was up to date in response to my pre-delivery question. Turns out it's the 2017 map. Hardly confidence inspiring.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I negotiated a set of rubber mats in a deal for a Soul at about £35 on the invoice. Collected by Mrs FC. Mats were a cheapo £5 set from Poundstretcher or other such emporium Same dealer that I'm having this issue with.
 

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Similar thing today
Got my 2017 Sportage GT line back
£450 Lighter
Smell of diesel
Had a look under the bonnet to fi nd the New fuel Filter hanging on by a thread and knocking against the body work
Bolts not done up and casing wet with Diesel
Also my brake bleed screws have not been touched
And the service book was not returned to me
Dont ask me about the wash the car was supposed to have
It would have been cleaner leaving it in the rain

Updates after i visit the dealer tomorrow
 

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A friend who was formerly an MOT tester and now runs a workshop told me a Peugeot main dealer brake fluid change was virtually syphon some fluid from the container and top up.

Its this kind of issue that drives people not to trust garage services especially considering the labour cost

Another concern i have is the dealer using oil of the correct specifications particularly when DPF systems required low ash
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I thought I'd updated this thread with the result but cant find any update. (Maybe it was on other forums.) I was intending to link to it for the information of someone whos booked a service with the particular dealer. I know I've alluded to it in other threads but I'll finish the story. Its copy and paste as I cant be bothered to type it all again:

I didn't mention it in my original post but I was a little suspicious of the colour of the oil when I did my check and found the brakes had not been bled. It was black. I know diesel oil turns black extremely quickly but never the less this was well black.
So the following day I took off the under body tray which in itself revealed it had probably not been off. What certainly had not been off was the sump plug. However I know that some outfits drain by suction through the dipstick. Further exploration around the oil filter housing (cartridge filter) was not quite so revealing but still suspicious. I have an oil pump so I extracted a sample of oil and delivered it to an oil sampling laboratory.

The result.

* 5w30 * suspected missed oil change *** IRON LEVELS APPEAR HIGH, POTENTIALLY INDICATING LINER WEAR. OTHER WEAR READINGS
ARE WITHIN TOLERANCE. SILICON IS HIGH AND MAY INDICATE EITHER SEAL WEAR, OR DIRT INGRESS. HOWEVER THE VISCOSITY
APPEARS A LITTLE LOW AND APPROXIMATELY 2% FUEL DILUTION IS DETECTED. READINGS INDICATE THE OIL WAS NOT CHANGED.

Today I spent some time with the Group General Service Manager discussing and coming to an agreement whilst my oil was being changed. He informed me his intention was to conduct a 'disciplinary ' with the technician and my evidence was conclusive.

What I don't understand is that when they got rumbled for the brake fluid and it went back into the workshop the Technician didn't have a prick of conscience and realising they had been rumbled use the opportunity to sort the oil out. Touch of arrogance and stupidity.

Kia Customer Services seemed quite indifferent and pushed the onus back to the Dealership. Again I'm surprised that they seemed somewhat ambivalent to the the potential damage exposure of these practices could do to the brand. But I was probably dealing with someone whose job description includes batting off complaints at all odds.

IMG_3429.jpeg


This was Ringways Kia, Doncaster.
 

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Pleased that you named and shamed the dealer. Shocked that "Kia Customer Services seemed quite indifferent and pushed the onus back to the Dealership." That tells a lot about what KIA thinks of those of us who spend our money with them and their dealers. They only exist because of the people who buy their products. No customers, no business.
 

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Just remember that KCS are a 3rd party co that deal with Kia Warranty issues. They do not have power over Franchised dealers. Only Kia Bolton is a actual Kia owned dealer.
So in reality any franchised dealer problems possibly need to be taken up direct with Kia UK, who at a guess are the one's that hand out the franchises.

Personally Have used Ringways Leeds for many services on both our Kia's and have had no issues. So if in your case it was just one tech who was shirking on what they should have been doing who knows.
Did you send the oil off to be tested?
 

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Talking about dealer servicing. I recently bought a 17 plate Sportage from a KIA dealer. 4th service completed tuesday, car picked up wednesday. A week later I was reading the manual and saw how easy it was to change the pollen filter. My recent cars have been a major strip down so I thought I'll try this as it's only a 2 minute job.
What was in there was a filter that hadn't been changed since new, completely blocked with a desiccated dead mouse on top.
When I dropped the glove box I also found an insurance document for the original owner from 2017. Why would anyone put this back if they had changed the filter?
Also checked the oil which I thought was pretty black for 100 miles in a petrol engine so I assume this hadn't been done either.
Looking at the service record, the same dealer completed services 2 and 3!
Anyway after a few phone calls, emails etc. car went back for a pollen filter and possible oil change. Apparently the filter is only a check and not a change, they couldn't understand why it wasn't changed as obviously it was in a disgraceful state but surprisingly the "mechanic" and I use the term loosely was on holiday. (right!!!)
Anyway they supposedly changed the filter (I daren't check) but not the oil. I changed the oil myself and unbelievably it's still golden after 500 miles.
They did update maps for free, but only because I asked for it.
On the way home I noticed they had unplugged my dashcam and forgot to reconnect it. (I can understand why they would unplug it especially when I saw the state of the garage before they disconnected but I only noticed it wasn't working 10 miles down the road)
Anyway rant over, the 3 year service plan that I took out has been cancelled. I'll be taking it to my trusted independent and I'll never darken their door again. If I need any warranty work I'll be finding another kia garage.
8145
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Discussion Starter #15
Do you wish to name and shame?
Whilst I'm with you all the way re utilising an independent there is a recent thread regarding someone who did that and Kia are going out of their way to ensure that all service components were of a compatible standard and complied with their servicing requirements, which in itself is a major balls ache. Such things as seeing the garages own invoices to establish that the 5w 30 was of the required spec.
As much as it hurts it is sometimes easier to go with the flow. And they know it.
Seems that actually not completing a service is not an issue providing the vehicle has the all important Kia service stamp.
 

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Same as my Venga when "serviced?" by NK Derby
Pollen Filter was black and they gave the "check only" reply, but then said they should have spotted it as its an upsell opportunity. They had no responses when I asked what else did the "technician" miss
It suggests in many cases customers are paying simply for a tick sheet to be ticked rather than the work actually being done. This also means that a "Used Approved" car could theoretically have never had a correct service so customers are paying top price for what essentially is a distinctly average car.
 

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Do you wish to name and shame?
Whilst I'm with you all the way re utilising an independent there is a recent thread regarding someone who did that and Kia are going out of their way to ensure that all service components were of a compatible standard and complied with their servicing requirements, which in itself is a major balls ache. Such things as seeing the garages own invoices to establish that the 5w 30 was of the required spec.
As much as it hurts it is sometimes easier to go with the flow. And they know it.
Seems that actually not completing a service is not an issue providing the vehicle has the all important Kia service stamp.
I'm not really ok with naming and shaming, yet. Obviously I may need their help with any warranty work and naming them on here wouldn't really help my case. As it stands I believe/hope I am in a situation where they need to keep me sweet if I have to return the car for any reason. Although I also realise that everyone is a number and once the cars out the showroom they quickly forget the purchaser.
I'd also like to add that it isn't just Kia, I had a service completed at Jaguar and they left the undertray hanging, luckily I noticed before leaving the forecourt.
I actually believe that servicing by any main dealer is hit and miss because they don't have to try to get customers, most buyers haven't a clue about maintenance on a vehicle and believe main dealers are the best available whilst a local small garage has to do the job correctly as he needs the customer to return.
 

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I've not long had my first service done..thinking I should have checked everything before I left now lol.

When I had my Seat Curpra 280 a mate of mine had the 290 and took it for its first service at the same dealer we got them from. He got half way home only to find they had left the oil cap off and smoke was coming from under the bonnet :-/

I used to have everything done independently when I owned the cars, but previous lease vehicles, etc came with servicing and as I was giving back to them, I didn't care too much then.

I may pay more attention at second service given what I have read on here. I've still not done 4000 miles in mine as it's just sat outside. I run it into the office once a week and back down the motorway and then on the weekend down some nice 60 mph lanes to take wife over to her mom's (not so much now obviously). So at least when it is used it gets a decent run and fully up to temp.
 

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I'm not really ok with naming and shaming, yet. Obviously I may need their help with any warranty work and naming them on here wouldn't really help my case. As it stands I believe/hope I am in a situation where they need to keep me sweet if I have to return the car for any reason. Although I also realise that everyone is a number and once the cars out the showroom they quickly forget the purchaser.
I'd also like to add that it isn't just Kia, I had a service completed at Jaguar and they left the undertray hanging, luckily I noticed before leaving the forecourt.
I actually believe that servicing by any main dealer is hit and miss because they don't have to try to get customers, most buyers haven't a clue about maintenance on a vehicle and believe main dealers are the best available whilst a local small garage has to do the job correctly as he needs the customer to return.
I think I may speak for a few here, I do find it quite selfish if one doesn't name and shame. Why would someone wish to have others fall in to the same scenario without giving them a warning, in my book this is very self serving.
Unless these inferior dealerships are named and shamed there will be never be an improvement to their standards or/and services.

In addition to other criticisms I have posted on other threads about main dealerships, here is my general brief insight into main dealerships which is a tad tongue in cheek but I'm sure you will get my drift.
I have reluctantly worked with main dealerships as my customers for decades, please believe me as I would choose to work with an independent garage facility any day. Fortunately I have being retired for nearly fifteen years and don't miss the deception of the main dealerships one iota, although I'm still at this time financially connected to the industry.
Firstly most dealerships are owned by faceless conglomerates, this makes it almost impossible to communicate with a human that can make a decision.
But we'll start at the top, Mr Dealer Principal, or as some are now called, Head of Business. He or she is just a hard nosed number cruncher who is totally answerable to head office to produce profit at any cost from units.
Down the line we have the dealer accountant, this is the clever person that ties all the financial deals together that the inept ex ice cream come car salesmen can't manage but who's actually managed to sell a car. Then we also have the yes people in all the receptions that make the yes promises but don't or can't carry them through or deliver.
Moving on towards the workshop side of things. The service manager, he's probably not seen an engine for some time if ever but is the main line of defence and is probably the most negative thinker towards the customer. He never get's to go on the factory courses as do the adolescents on the workshop floor. The newish boy's or girls generally do the servicing, so here starts the problems. These are the young breed of up and coming fitters of new parts but the franchises will keep calling them technicians. This term is used because the main head boy gets the diagnostic tool and plugs into the DL16 socket and reads out what the screen says, and here starts even more problems because it's all down to interpretation.
Does it not strike you strange that you very rarely walk into a showroom or reception and see anybody over thirty somethings, the same if you manage to get your nose through the workshop door it's akin a creche.
Next time you go to drop your car off, take some time to look about the place and draw your own conclusions.
Or am I just a cynical old bar steward ;)
 

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And on the other side! I have been a customer of Drayton motor's Swineshead Boston Lincs since:)(y) 2004 when it was run by a two man operation that supplied and serviced my two Sorento's. When it it was taken over by a much larger franchise I had reservations as to the service I would receive. To date I have no complaints with good, friendly, and efficient service, with nothing being too much for them to do. I would recommend them entirely, based on my experience over 15 years.
Am I the lucky one??
 
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