[stevelaf50]

I have a 2008 carens CRDT
When accelerating gently the engine appears to misfire between 1400 adn 2100 Revs
Local garage seam unable to find the fault
It has been back to them 3 times so far and although they agree there is a problem they cannot offer a solution
Has anyone else had similar problems and found a cure

 

[murphwiz]

Check it's had the ECU upgrade to fix this issue.
Also when it's surging, switch ac on, if it goes way, and ecu is updated, the EGR valve needs repalcing.

 

[Quiltman]

Hi, I have exactly the same problem with a 2 month old LS crdi. (6000 miles on clock)Thought it was just my gentle foot causing the throttle position sensor to be unsure if the throttle was open or closed! Took it to local dealer yesterday and showed him the problem. booked in Monday for check but they did the ECU upgrade last week at an oil change.Will try the AC trick tomorrow. Will print Murphwiz's answer out to show them and report back in due course.

 

[murphwiz]

There is a whole new technical bulletin covering this issue, every dealer is aware of it (well should be)

 

[Quiltman]

Thanks murphwiz.Will go "chat" with dealer tomorrow.
To be fair to them they could not replicate the problem last week, but after a test drive yesterday they agree there is a problem and the service manager said he would check all the recent service bulletins before I take vehicle in next week in case they missed something.

other than this problem the vehicle has been superb.

 

[syr]

Hello about the kia carens engine surging problem you said there is a technical bulletin covering this issue is there any way I can get it, so I can show it to my dealer. My dealer doesn't seem to find the problem""¦






P.S - my Carens is October 09

 

[murphwiz]

As yours is a new model, then current bulletin may not apply, I'm told there is another ecu upgrade in testing at the moment however.
Ask your dealer to log into the tech hotline website, and look at the home page where it says carens diesel hesitation.

 

[nsmith1180]

Is there not a fix for this EGR valve problem?? I dont know alot about Kia, but the Vauxhall/Saab/Fiat/Alfa 1.9 CDTi 150bhp was a nightmare for clogging up the EGR valve, so they sent out a tool for cleaning it out! I know it wasnt a long term solution, but EGRs for those engines Z19DTH if I remember rightly have been on backorder now for about 2 years!

 

[murphwiz]

Ah I recognise that name from pistonheads...
The EGR problem seems to exclusively effect the carens, with very limited issues with other models using same engine, The bulletin is quite comprehensive in it's fix, and technical are sure it will fix 99% of cases, I know there is another ecm upgrade in testing to completely cure the issue.

 

[nsmith1180]

Indeed, it is me nsmith1180 from PH!


Good to know the problem isnt as big here as in VX/Saab/Fiat/Alfa and whoever else use the Z19DTH.



Oh and clear your PMs inbox if you want me to reply.
Edited by: nsmith1180

 

[murphwiz]

Cleared

 

[syr]

Thank you for your reply. Will talk to dealer.

 

[JohnM]

Last year we purchased a 58 reg 2.0 GS automatic that displayed the same faults as described above. Despite it having the ECU updated and exhaust valve replaced the problem remained and the vehicle was eventually, after much cajoling and having a fitter sit with me to experience the fault, changed for an 08 LS model.

The last solution that KIA came up with was a fuel additive which seemed like a stop gap solution and was refused.

Of late, the present Carens 2.0 LS automatic has been showing the same fault with the engine surging on gentle acceleration. This can be overcome with a slight delay by accelerating hard. At times, whilst the engine surges, there can be heard a scraping sound as though a revolving metal disc is rubbing - it is not the brakes.

Like previous members, I initially put the problem down to my driving and a soft right foot.

The vehicle is due to be serviced very soon and I shall mention the bulletin, ECU and exhaust valve when it is booked in.

 

[murphwiz]

And there is yet another ecu upgrade available for this issue.

 

[JohnM]

Thank you for the info, I shall have more words with the Service Manager.

Much of the problem is that the fault does not appear on any of the diagnostic tools and it is only when it happens whilst a fitter is present that it is acknowledged.

Almost a case of 'you are just the drivers, what do you know about it?'

 

[murphwiz]

To be fair, it's not a certainty yours will be fixed with an ecu upgrade, and it is fairly impossible to fix a car that isn't broken at the time of testing, I have to explain to customers that it's just not in my interests to tell them we can't currently fault the car, kia don't pay for testing and finding no fault under the warranty.

 

[JohnM]

I accept that intermittent faults are the most difficult to diagnose and rectify. If the car, or any other piece of machinery, is functioning normally at the time of testing then the fault cannot be diagnosed and, by definition, cannot be rectified.

It seems to be the price paid for advancement in technology whereby the diagnostic tools are necessary as systems become ever more complicated. Perhaps, in time and as the cost reduces, it will be possible to have a 'black box' type system that will record everything that happens between services rather like on railway locomotives.

In the meantime, this seems to be a common fault with the KIA and mars an, otherwise, good vehicle.

 

[DeeDee]

We bought a brand new 09 Carens GS in June 09 within 3 weeks the surging started. It went back 3 to the garage (a round trip of over 60miles) within 2 months it had the ECU upgrade and the EGR valve replaced but no difference. With alot of pressure put onto both the Garage and Kia Customer Services they agreed to take it back and replace it with another one. We picked up the 59 reg in October. That is now doing the same thing. They have checked the ECU and EGR but are now saying that there is no problem - that the car is drving as it should and it is a characteristic of the vehicle / more have the characteristic than don't and finally- it is the way we are driving it!! I have lost the will to live in trying to fight with them anymore - all my reasonings with them are met with wierder and lamer excuses. The garage say they can do nothing without Kia's approval, Kia Customer Services say it is nothing to do with them it is up to the garage we bought it from to rectify it. No win situation -- anyone want a Kia Carens that has just had a tow bar fitted to it at 9the garage has said that the surging gets worse when towing -never told us that prior to taking rhe money off us!)

 

[mike549]

I have just got my car back after awhile in the garage and alot of work under warranty being done. And mine too is now what you call surging and i've only had it a week, which is wasn't doing when it was running before the first major issue. I thought it was because it had all new parts fitted and just settling in but it is getting worse now!Had a chat with the most helpful mech. . Now don't quote me on this but he believes that it may be the other 2 injectors as i had 2 replaced and 2 seemed fine at the time. Also this problem, is a problem, with quite alot of diesel kia's at the moment according to one mech i was talking to as he said to me is the car hessitating while driving?,also there was a different kia model in at the same time as mine with exactally the same problem. He took ours out for a driveto see what it was doing and see if he could sumise from the drive what was wrong. It can't be the EGR as it's had a new one along with numerous other new parts so the only logical thingis the 2 injectors.
As far as being told by your dealer "it's the way you drive and a characteristic of the model" thats BS i've had many a diesel car but never had a problem like this feels like its misfiring at times anyway keep your chin up

 

[Quiltman]

I had my EGR replaced at 3 months (6000 miles) and since then has been fine until a couple of weeks ago. it seems worse if the car has been standing for 45 minutes or so after a run. I know its the EGR again as switching on the AC cures it - originally suggested by Murphwiz. some days tho' its perfect!Reported it to the local Kia garage - Victor Wood - who immediately said it could be a pipe thats blocked, but they'd ensure they had a new EGR ready for when it goes in for its 20,000 service just in case - next week. It's a bit of a bummer, but I feel it's a little unfair to just blame KIA as the EGR is part of the Bosch CRD system and the service manager, who is relatively new, says he changed loads at the Vauxhall garage he previously worked at and he knows the local VW garage has also changed some.It does seem worse when using gentle acceleration, hard acceleration means you get through the power band (1700-2100RPM) where it occurs quickly.Just Google EGR problems!
Other than this problem my Carens has been great from Day 1. Cruises all day at 60/65 and has now settled at around 44/45mpg each month with mixed town/dual carriageway running. (I reset my trip computer on the 1st of the month)
Certainly Victor Wood have never indicated that the problem has anything to do with either the way I drive, or the type of trips I make.
On the other hand, my brother in law also has a Carens, bought new last October, and has not had a hint of surging.
Just make sure that anytime you have a problem that you report it to the local KIA garage to ensure its logged against your vehicle - that way KIA cannot deny responsibility when it all goes t**s up!